I worked in mental health my entire career and were indeed always told not to give advice, but to let the person come to their own conclusions. It is widely believed that "you can't force insight." Yet I wonder if that is in fact true. Once it has been stated, we can always find examples to support it - of people who thought it impertinent or unhelpful to give advice and others who displayed wisdom by refraining and respecting our autonomy or some such. Yet if we were the other sort of person, who frequently offered advice, we would have examples too. There is a selection bias here. Just because we can picture a busybody who should just shut up, or imagine a wise grandmother who facilitated a person making their own decision does not mean those are a majority. It might just be a nice story. We could make opposite nice stories of people who thankfully stepped in when we were too proud or stupid to ask.
Nor do I see how we would easily measure which of these is correct. "If we take 100 people matched for age, education, etc..." well, what? What then? How do we tell how much they need advice, whether they are actually asking for it, whether their outcomes were better (or merely seem so to them).
I am not arguing the opposite, that all of us should start looking for more people to jump in and give advice to. I just think this might be a cultural belief, even a myth, rather than a proven one.
Yes, I agree with you that confirmation bias is powerful, whether on the question of advice or anything else. If we believe that giving advice is usually a good thing, then we can find examples to support it. I also agree that most of what therapists believe is closer to mythology, or folk wisdom, than actual science. For example, in addition to "you can't force insight," I've also heard "you can't help someone who doesn't want to help themselves" and "you can only take clients as far as you've gone yourself." I think both are nonsense, and to the extent that they prevent therapists from trying to help, say, a resistant client, they're counter-productive.
Anyway, thank you for taking the time to read the article and offer your reply.
Thanks for such a nuanced insightful piece. It was a revelation. I'm remembering the time I asked a group of friends for advice about selling my house. I'd received several offers and was unsure which to accept. Never has one of my requests for help been met with such alacrity, so thoroughly did my buddies enjoy commenting on my situation. It was a fulfilling converation for me, not so much because I thought their advice was valuable as that I knew that I had kicked off such a spirited discussion.
Hm, interesting. I wonder if the "virtual play" argument explains their alacrity, or something else? If I put myself in your friends' shoes, I can similarly feel an eagerness to share my two cents...anyway, if you have any thoughts, let me know. And thank you for reading the article and taking the time to reply.
Thanks for your response. Yes, I think "virtual play" is a good way to describe the conversation, virtual for all players, anyway, except me! Thinking about it now, I think a number of factors came together to make the conversation stimulating. I asked for advice very directly so there was no doubt opinions were welcome. The subject was clearly inside my friend's area of expertise and outside of mine, so everyone had an opportunity to contribute meaningfully. We were in a small group of pals so all the advice givers had the opportunity to demonstrate their knowledge in front of a friendly audience. It was a high stakes decision and yet, at the same time not emotionally fraught: I had a number of options, all of them good, so the atmosphere was relaxed.
I worked in mental health my entire career and were indeed always told not to give advice, but to let the person come to their own conclusions. It is widely believed that "you can't force insight." Yet I wonder if that is in fact true. Once it has been stated, we can always find examples to support it - of people who thought it impertinent or unhelpful to give advice and others who displayed wisdom by refraining and respecting our autonomy or some such. Yet if we were the other sort of person, who frequently offered advice, we would have examples too. There is a selection bias here. Just because we can picture a busybody who should just shut up, or imagine a wise grandmother who facilitated a person making their own decision does not mean those are a majority. It might just be a nice story. We could make opposite nice stories of people who thankfully stepped in when we were too proud or stupid to ask.
Nor do I see how we would easily measure which of these is correct. "If we take 100 people matched for age, education, etc..." well, what? What then? How do we tell how much they need advice, whether they are actually asking for it, whether their outcomes were better (or merely seem so to them).
I am not arguing the opposite, that all of us should start looking for more people to jump in and give advice to. I just think this might be a cultural belief, even a myth, rather than a proven one.
Yes, I agree with you that confirmation bias is powerful, whether on the question of advice or anything else. If we believe that giving advice is usually a good thing, then we can find examples to support it. I also agree that most of what therapists believe is closer to mythology, or folk wisdom, than actual science. For example, in addition to "you can't force insight," I've also heard "you can't help someone who doesn't want to help themselves" and "you can only take clients as far as you've gone yourself." I think both are nonsense, and to the extent that they prevent therapists from trying to help, say, a resistant client, they're counter-productive.
Anyway, thank you for taking the time to read the article and offer your reply.
Thanks for such a nuanced insightful piece. It was a revelation. I'm remembering the time I asked a group of friends for advice about selling my house. I'd received several offers and was unsure which to accept. Never has one of my requests for help been met with such alacrity, so thoroughly did my buddies enjoy commenting on my situation. It was a fulfilling converation for me, not so much because I thought their advice was valuable as that I knew that I had kicked off such a spirited discussion.
Hm, interesting. I wonder if the "virtual play" argument explains their alacrity, or something else? If I put myself in your friends' shoes, I can similarly feel an eagerness to share my two cents...anyway, if you have any thoughts, let me know. And thank you for reading the article and taking the time to reply.
Thanks for your response. Yes, I think "virtual play" is a good way to describe the conversation, virtual for all players, anyway, except me! Thinking about it now, I think a number of factors came together to make the conversation stimulating. I asked for advice very directly so there was no doubt opinions were welcome. The subject was clearly inside my friend's area of expertise and outside of mine, so everyone had an opportunity to contribute meaningfully. We were in a small group of pals so all the advice givers had the opportunity to demonstrate their knowledge in front of a friendly audience. It was a high stakes decision and yet, at the same time not emotionally fraught: I had a number of options, all of them good, so the atmosphere was relaxed.
All good points. The situation does indeed sound ripe for advice. Hope it translated into a good deal!
This is awesome !! And thanks to @Rob for linking it to his recent article as well
I appreciate it, and I agree that it was very kind of him to do so.
It was a very insightful and extremely timely read for some situations in my life at present. Thank you.
Thank you, I am glad to hear it.
Excellent article. Thanks.
Thank you, I appreciate you taking the time to read it.
Really enjoyed this.
Thank you, I appreciate you taking the time to read it.